Re: Ironsides

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: : : : : : : : : :Back in 1988 I worked on a charter boat off of Key West one our deeper dives(the coral reef system in the Keys is very shallow) was the cayman salvor a old coast gaurd cutter they had sank in the seventys as a artifical reef in 120 feet of water after a mild hurrican we went out to dive the 280ft wreck to find out it was sitting upright before the hurrican it had lied on its port side, Here in Door County we find ice damage down to 60 ft, in 1991 a large piece of keel with a portion of the bow of an old schooner came in on an ice flow and landed just north of the canal, unfortunately your problem with old ironsides is not that uncommon, specialy if it is in a high energy enviroment (strong currents ice flows ect.) dive it while you can. : : : : : : : : : For those of you who regularly dive the Ironsides off Grand Haven, here's some more bad news. As many of you know, the bow end of the wreck has been gone since the mid 1970s (some say it was dynamited by divers). Now the stern section is disappearing. : : : : : : : : : : Right after the storm of 10 November 1998, we discovered the stern had begun to collapse. Subsequent storms had done further damage including further collapse of the stern area. Yesterday, Doug Welsch and I dove her again, only to find that the storms of two weeks ago (20 foot waves on Lake Michigan) have apparently caused even more damage. The starboard side of the ship has now peeled away almost all the way back to the stern. The port side seems to have collapsed inward, with the deck dropping downward on top of it. The rudder and the propellers are nearly buried now and the once proud steering post and capstan are lost among the rubble. : : : : : : : : : : At this rate, it won't be many years before this wreck is simply two engines, two boilers and a pile of wet wood. It sad to see it go. I'd suggest diving it soon. By the way, the water was warm (51 F), the waves were rolling at about 1-3 feet and the vis was very good! You gotta love November diving! : : : : : : : : : : I'm interested in the opinions of the group as to the destruction of this wreck. Why is it continuing to deteriorate when similar-aged vessels in the Straits and Alpena areas are relatively unchanged in the 12 years I've been actively diving them? I mean this is really noticable! Can the waves, currents, etc. really be having an impact at 120 feet? We usually notice damage right after major storms. Can it be a coincidence? : : : : : : : : : : Or, could this ship have been structurally damaged more than the others due to the violence of the sinking event in 1873? Could it have been poor construction? Some reports claim she was in rough shape when she sank. : : : : : : : : : : Just wondering. It's sad to see an old friend dying a slow death. : : : : : : : : : : Craig Rich : : : : : : : : : : Holland, MI : : : : : : : : How about salvageing all items of historical interest and donate to a local historical group for public display before all is lost forever. : : : : : : : Now there's an idea that makes sense. I'm with you! : : : : : : Until some curator from the state historical society gets busted for selling them and gets sentenced to 15 years. They are no better than any of the divers I have ever met. : : : : : Again I hear the words sell shipwreck items! Sell !! to who?? can you give me factual cases That you know of someone selling shipwreck atrifacts in the great lakes area ??I think this selling of artifacts is the fantasy of a few missguided divers.I would really like to hear of a actual example of this happening and what was sold ? for what price? and what was the item and to whom Tim : : : : SURE, : : : : His name was David Wooley. He just got senteced to 15 years followed by 30 years probation. He waorked for the Wisconsin Sate Historical Society and stole/ sold about $100,000 in artifacts- all while working FOR the goverment. It's in all the papers this week. : : : : Jon : : : Thanks for the info. What were the artifacts made of solid gold??I would like to read the article I am fom Michigan. The $$$ amount would seem to be highly exagerated. What was sold and who was the buyer/buyers.I would really like to see what is worth that kind of money in the great lakes.Any web/site that would have the article posted.100,000.00??????????????????????????? : : Try the Milwaukee Journal. They have an on-line site that will have the article from the past week on it. : : Jon : : Thanks Tim

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